US Politics Thread |OT| THE DARKEST TIMELINE

[Rufus]

I'd like to think so, anyway.

[Phoenix Dark]

The thing that baffles me: if you want to end the safety net, wouldn't it make sense to support policies that decrease demand for a safety net? If you pay people $5 an hour all you do is explode Medicaid rolls. If you pay people a decent living wage you begin to decrease the safety net simply by moving folks off of it.

[Human Snorenado]

The thing that baffles me: if you want to end the safety net, wouldn't it make sense to support policies that decrease demand for a safety net? If you pay people $5 an hour all you do is explode Medicaid rolls. If you pay people a decent living wage you begin to decrease the safety net simply by moving folks off of it.

There you go again, making the mistake of believing that these people think about anything.

[Joe Molotov]

More poor people = more people to look down on so I can feel better about myself.

[Rufus]

The logic behind that is that drink and laziness create the demand for those policies, not the lack of jobs. There's always going to be some amount of joblessness, but that has has to be denied, because it doesn't fit the belief system.
It's also useful to make receiving help as uncomfortable as possible, to create downward pressure on wages. Wouldn't wanna be one of those leeches now, would you? Better stay at that shit job. A bird in your hand is better than two in the bush.
And so what if it hits those that legitimately need help. They are a minority so they have no political power, no need to cater to them. They didn't have enough magical willpower to make it anyway, so fuck 'em.

[Oblivion]

The thing that baffles me: if you want to end the safety net, wouldn't it make sense to support policies that decrease demand for a safety net? If you pay people $5 an hour all you do is explode Medicaid rolls. If you pay people a decent living wage you begin to decrease the safety net simply by moving folks off of it.

What if we not raise the minimum wage AND destroy all welfare programs?

Problem solved forever!

[Phoenix Dark]

Surely a logical conservative can realize the safety net isn't going anywhere, especially with the ACA expanding Medicaid in many states (soon to be most). The best way to lower rolls is to foster an economy where the working poor can move into the middle class, not one in which the middle class becomes the working poor.

But then again if I was a republican, I'd be super far right and make racial comments about Obama/black people to sell my book, Escaping The Liberal Plantation: How Blacks Can Redeem Themselves.

[Great Rumbler]

PD is The Bore's own Ben Carson.

[Human Snorenado]

Surely a logical conservative can realize the safety net isn't going anywhere, especially with the ACA expanding Medicaid in many states (soon to be most). The best way to lower rolls is to foster an economy where the working poor can move into the middle class, not one in which the middle class becomes the working poor.

But then again if I was a republican, I'd be super far right and make racial comments about Obama/black people to sell my book, Escaping The Liberal Plantation: How Blacks Can Redeem Themselves.

"Surely, all unicorns..."

[benjipwns]

http://dailycaller.com/2014/02/10/joe-scarborough-believed-to-be-taking-idea-of-2016-presidential-bid-seriously/

It’s widely believed at MSNBC — including among network brass — that Scarborough is actively mulling a presidential bid, sources said.

Meanwhile, some of Scarborough’s guests are beginning to talk him up as a possible candidate. Mark McKinnon — the former adviser to George W. Bush and John McCain who co-founded the group No Labels and appears on Morning Joe regularly — said he has talked about the prospect of a White House campaign with Scarborough “ever since we first met years ago, but always in the abstract.”

“On paper, he’s a great candidate,” McKinnon told The Daily Caller. “He has the kind of confidence, ideas and media savvy required to make it on the big stage. And he’d be a lot of fun to watch because he wouldn’t be afraid to mix it up with anybody on any topic. I think it would be highly entertaining and good for the party.”

Added McKinnon: “I think Joe looks at the potential field and thinks, ‘I could compete.’ And I think there are potential donors and supporters who think the same thing.”

Another Scarborough friend — a Republican who has appeared as a guest on Morning Joe many times — said the notion of a 2016 campaign is no joke: “I definitely wouldn’t fall in the laughing category.”

“I think it’s a very wide open field,” the friend told TheDC by phone. “He’s an articulate spokesperson for conservatives. No doubt about it.”

Here is the thinking behind a Scarborough bid:

The field is wide open.
Republicans won’t nominate a senator. They want a D.C. outsider.
Scarborough would perform well in debates, which mattered in the 2012 contest.
Scarborough, through his recent book, has offered a blueprint for reform for the GOP.

Scarborough acknowledged that he wrote his recent book, “The Right Path: From Ike to Reagan, How Republicans Once Mastered Politics–and Can Again,” with the 2016 presidential election in mind.

“The reason I wrote the book and the reason I’m going around the country talking about these issues is because 2016 is going to be an extraordinarily important year,” Scarborough said. “We can’t lose another election.”

[Joe Molotov]

Sure, there's still room in the clown car for more.


Maybe he'll even quit his day job to run...

[Phoenix Dark]

On July 20, 2001, one of Scarborough's aides died after hitting her head on a desk when she fainted while alone in Scarborough's Fort Walton Beach, Florida, office.[25] According to Scarborough, soon after the death, allegations "spread all over the Internet" that he had been involved,.[25][26] There was no evidence of foul play.

Yea...I doubt he's running for shit.

[Human Snorenado]

It doesn't matter if he runs. He'll be a non-factor, because the only people he's popular with are establishment media types.  Anyone seriously think GOP primary voters are gonna support this guy?

[Great Rumbler]

On July 20, 2001, one of Scarborough's aides died after hitting her head on a desk when she fainted while alone in Scarborough's Fort Walton Beach, Florida, office.[25] According to Scarborough, soon after the death, allegations "spread all over the Internet" that he had been involved,.[25][26] There was no evidence of foul play.

Yea...I doubt he's running for shit.

I intended to post this very thing.

[benjipwns]

It doesn't matter if he runs. He'll be a non-factor, because the only people he's popular with are establishment media types.

Weekly Standard editor Bill Kristol suggested on the air that Scarborough could represent the “Jon Huntsman lane” in a 2016 GOP primary.

[Brehvolution]

I'm just interested in seeing how they'll get the base to rally behind a guy who works for......... MSNBC.

[ToxicAdam]

I don't think an opinion maker or a talking head can ever (successfully) run for President.  They just don't have the tools to succeed and many people already might have a predisposition to dislike them. Just because you can 'talk the game', doesn't mean people will believe what you say.

It would be like hiring a football analyst to be a GM of an NFL franchise. Who would think that could work?

[Positive Touch]

even that dudes co-workers can't fucking stand him

but shit I hope he does run so it gets his ass off my tv

[Brehvolution]

I'd vote for Mika* before Joe.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

*

[close]

[Oblivion]

PD is The Bore's own Ben Carson.

I thought you were posting old news but turns out this is recent. 

[benjipwns]

McClatchy/Marist Poll showing similar implosion to CNN one from last week:

Clinton 55, Huckabee 41   Clinton +14
Clinton 58, Christie 37   Clinton +21
Clinton 52, Ryan 44   Clinton +8
Clinton 58, Paul 38   Clinton +20
Clinton 58, Bush 38   Clinton +20
Clinton 58, Rubio 37   Clinton +21
Clinton 53, Romney 44  Clinton +9
Clinton 62, Palin 35  Clinton +27

He's in free fall:
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/us/general_election_christie_vs_clinton-3766.html

[Human Snorenado]

Morning Joe has a sad

[Joe Molotov]

Debt ceiling passes. Ted Cruz wanted to filibuster, but Mitch McConnell shot it down, hopefully giving more fuel for McConnell's primary challenger. 

[Oblivion]

Morning Joe has a sad

Why? Cause of Christie's falling poll numbers or cause no one's talking about Scarborough being a presidential contender?

[Joe Molotov]

God will repeal Obamacare, game over Obama.

[Brehvolution]

Drinky is more of a christian than Bachman is. Christains like Bachman make christians look bad.

[Oblivion]

Was just about to post that.

How is this supposed to work exactly? If prayer worked towards stopping Obamacare, wouldn't it never have been passed to begin with? Does that mean God supports Obamacare, or that it was God's punishment for the American people being insufficiently Christian? And how does this explain the 2012 election? Maybe the people who prayed for Obamacare to remain cancelled out the people who prayed for it to be repealed?

[Brehvolution]

I'm sure God prefers the great system we had before Obamacare. 

[Oblivion]

[Joe Molotov]

I'm sure God prefers the great system we had before Obamacare. 

Well, it did typically require a lot more praying...

[benjipwns]

http://www.newrepublic.com/article/116601/chris-christies-rise-and-fall

Not really surprising, but this is the kind of stuff that the Romney camp (and others beforehand) were hinting about after looking into him and why some thought Christie's teams "incompetence" at delivering info was intentional to stop "allies" from continuing to look into it.

For all the complaining about Obama not being vetted, Republicans might want to be a little more thorough before latching onto their next hero (Cain, Trump, Christie, etc.) just because he's firing them up by bashing some Democrats.

Of course, knowing Christie's openly public background should have been a good enough indication. 

[Phoenix Dark]

Federal Judge: Virginia Gay Marriage Unconstitutional



NORFOLK, Va. (AP) — A federal judge ruled Thursday that Virginia's ban on same-sex marriage is unconstitutional, making it the first state in the South to have its voter-approved prohibition overturned.

U.S. District Judge Arenda Wright Allen issued a stay of her order while it is appealed, meaning that gay couples in Virginia will still not be able to marry until the case is ultimately resolved. Both sides believe the case won't be settled until the Supreme Court decides to hear it or one like it.

Allen's ruling makes Virginia the second state in the South to issue a ruling recognizing the legality of gaymarriages.

A judge in Kentucky ruled Wednesday that the state must recognize same-sex marriages performed in other states. It did not rule on the constitutionality of same-sex marriages inside the state, however. The Virginiajudge's ruling also follows similar decisions in Utah and Oklahoma federal courts.

"Through its decision today, the court has upheld the principles of equality upon which this nation was founded," the plaintiffs' lead co-counsel, Theodore B. Olson, said in a statement.

The Virginia Attorney General's Office took the unusual step of not defending the law because it believes the ban violates the equal protection clause of the 14th Amendment. In her ruling, Wright Allen agreed.

"The court is compelled to conclude that Virginia's Marriage Laws unconstitutionally deny Virginia's gay and lesbian citizens the fundamental freedom to choose to marry. Government interests in perpetuating traditions, shielding state matters from federal interference, and favoring one model of parenting over others must yield to this country's cherished protections that ensure the exercise of the private choices of the individual citizen regarding love and family," Wright Allen wrote.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/federal-judge-virginia-marriage-ban-unconstitutional

[AdmiralViscen]

Debt ceiling passes. Ted Cruz wanted to filibuster, but Mitch McConnell shot it down, hopefully giving more fuel for McConnell's primary challenger. 

I'm not sure this is a good thing. McConnell at least plays the game. A real fruit loop would be a big problem, especially if that person is Majority Leader.

[Oblivion]

Debt ceiling passes. Ted Cruz wanted to filibuster, but Mitch McConnell shot it down, hopefully giving more fuel for McConnell's primary challenger. 

I'm not sure this is a good thing. McConnell at least plays the game. A real fruit loop would be a big problem, especially if that person is Majority Leader.

This is one of the rare instances where, iirc, the biggest threat to a sitting Republican isn't a teabagger primary, but the actual Democrat opponent.

[Brehvolution]

Kentucky has pretty much come around to the fact that the GOP has been lying and fucking them over for decades.

[Brehvolution]

Kentucky has pretty much come around to the fact that the GOP has been lying and fucking them over for decades.

[AdmiralViscen]

Debt ceiling passes. Ted Cruz wanted to filibuster, but Mitch McConnell shot it down, hopefully giving more fuel for McConnell's primary challenger. 

I'm not sure this is a good thing. McConnell at least plays the game. A real fruit loop would be a big problem, especially if that person is Majority Leader.

This is one of the rare instances where, iirc, the biggest threat to a sitting Republican isn't a teabagger primary, but the actual Democrat opponent.

Mcconnels replacement as leader is not the person who wins his seat

[Phoenix Dark]

John Cornyn is next in line for minority leader of the Senate, if McConnell loses. I think he'll win although things are looking pretty bad for him. Still it's Kentucky...

At least Obamacare works in the state, which has played a part in McConnell's low poll numbers.

[Mupepe]

I wish John Cornyn would quit emailing me.

[Oblivion]

Debt ceiling passes. Ted Cruz wanted to filibuster, but Mitch McConnell shot it down, hopefully giving more fuel for McConnell's primary challenger. 

I'm not sure this is a good thing. McConnell at least plays the game. A real fruit loop would be a big problem, especially if that person is Majority Leader.

This is one of the rare instances where, iirc, the biggest threat to a sitting Republican isn't a teabagger primary, but the actual Democrat opponent.

Mcconnels replacement as leader is not the person who wins his seat

I know?

[AdmiralViscen]

Debt ceiling passes. Ted Cruz wanted to filibuster, but Mitch McConnell shot it down, hopefully giving more fuel for McConnell's primary challenger. 

I'm not sure this is a good thing. McConnell at least plays the game. A real fruit loop would be a big problem, especially if that person is Majority Leader.

This is one of the rare instances where, iirc, the biggest threat to a sitting Republican isn't a teabagger primary, but the actual Democrat opponent.

Mcconnels replacement as leader is not the person who wins his seat

I know?

Then your post was a non sequitur. One more D vote doesn't help if mcconnels replacement as minority/majority leader is even less willing to resist the tea party.

[Oblivion]

Oh, I see what happened. I meant to respond to Joe's post that you quoted, not your post.

[Brehvolution]

Queensghazi!

A New York GOP strategist has asked a federal judge to delay his corruption trial, arguing that the legal proceedings could reveal Republican strategies ahead of the 2014 state legislative and gubernatorial elections, according to the New York Post.

“The necessary witnesses to such a trial may include the Republican Party chairmen of the state and county Republican committees in New York,” Tabone’s lawyer said in a letter to the judge. “Subjecting the Republican Party, its officials and internal political strategies to intense scrutiny, while sparing the Democratic Party, would unfairly undermine Republican Party candidates in the general election."

“Questioning of party official witnesses will directly impact federal and state elections being held in New York by selectively exposing Republican Party strategy, the negotiation of cross-party endorsements for Republican candidates. In short, it could devolve into a political circus aimed at the Republican Party and its federal and state candidates.”

[Great Rumbler]

[Phoenix Dark]

[Great Rumbler]

"I LIKE TURTLE SOUP"

[benjipwns]

Why are the comments so negative? 

He could be the new Alvin Greene or Basil Marceaux.

[Joe Molotov]

He does look like a turtle, you can't really disagree with that part.

[Oblivion]

UGH.

So how many federal judges has the senate confirmed since the beginning of the year?

One.

Fucking ONE judge confirmed all this time, with over 900 remaining to be seated, with less than 10 months left to do so before the Dems, in all likelihood, lose the senate. Shifting the balance of the federal court system to the left should probably be the most important thing on the agenda this year, and arguably the most important legacy for Obama in his entire second term. This should have been a top priority. What the hell? 

spoiler (click to show/hide)

In fairness, the reason given for the slow nomination process is that it seems to be logistically very difficult. I get that, but STILL.

[close]

[Great Rumbler]

The process is only logistically very difficult when the minority party decides to effectively set a 60-vote threshold for every judicial nominee, regardless of their personal qualifications. which is what the GOP is doing and has done for several years now.

[benjipwns]

One interesting aspect to it outside of partisan games is that it looks like wait times, confirmation amounts, etc. have all been increasing since the 1970s irregardless of President/Congress/Senate party compositions so there does seem to be a component where it's another instance of the Senate basically just not doing anything if they can get away with it. Indeed, it seems like Reid just couldn't be bothered yet:

Reid can still schedule votes for nominees without the consent of Republicans, but it would be extremely time-consuming, requiring a full day to pass before even beginning debate and then anywhere from two to 30 hours for each nominee, per Senate rules. With unanimous consent, a nominee can be voted on in minutes.

A senior Senate Democratic aide said party leaders are trying to figure out a way to work together to let some judicial nominees through. But that isn't likely to happen until at least Feb. 24, when the Senate returns from a recess and begins a new work period. Even then, it could get messy.

Also, just to note,  I think you've got a typo there with the 900 judges, as I don't think there's even that many total federal judgeships. 

In fact, the only judicial nominee confirmed so far in 2014 has been Robert Wilkins, now a judge on the U.S. Court of Appeals for the D.C. Circuit whom Republicans blocked for months and who only got through after filibuster reform. That leaves 32 judicial nominees who are ready and waiting for a confirmation vote, but going nowhere.
...
There are now 96 judicial vacancies around the country

[Oblivion]

The process is only logistically very difficult when the minority party decides to effectively set a 60-vote threshold for every judicial nominee, regardless of their personal qualifications. which is what the GOP is doing and has done for several years now.

No, thanks to the nuclear option (thank you based Harry Reid ) they don't need to worry about Republican shenanigans for confirming judges. The problem right now, as benji posted, Democrats all need to free up time from things like committee meetings, fundraising and campaigning to vote, which can be pretty difficult.

Also, just to note,  I think you've got a typo there with the 900 judges, as I don't think there's even that many total federal judgeships. 

Yeah, you're right. It was over 90, not 900 I was thinking of.

[Mandark]

The first chucklehead to make an "over 9000" joke gets a swift e-punch to the e-face.

[tiesto]

So Cuomo wants to push a plan to give inmates a free college degree.

http://wivb.com/2014/02/17/cuomo-pushes-plan-to-give-inmates-free-degrees/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+wivb_offbeat+(WIVB.com+-+Offbeat+News)

I mean I'm as liberal as the next guy, but this is liberalism gone too far IMO... Offer people who commit crimes to get a free education, while law-abiding citizens have to pay up the ass for rapidly increasing college costs? It seems like a typical politician patchwork solution by throwing money at a problem aside from attacking the root causes - improve our state's poorest school districts, give them cash to provide after-school activities to help keep kids off the streets, improve access to mental health care, lower punishments for minor drug offenses, so people won't end up in jail in the first place!

[Eric P]

Well if education helps reduce recidivism then I'm all for it.

[benjipwns]

Cargo cult policy making.

Cuomo said, “Five hundred inmates were educated. Two-hundred-fifty were awarded degrees. The proof is in the pudding. Of those people who went through The Bard College program the recidivism rate has only been four percent compared to close to 50 percent.”

Now what's another possible direction of causality here, Governor?

[Mandark]

Sure, that stat's going to be inflated by selection bias, but I'm pretty sure that in general the literature points to prison education programs reducing recidivism, and possibly being directly cost-effective (in that the program costs less than the money saved from fewer reincarcerations).


edit: And sure, there are plenty of arguments to be made against the program, but it's not like the only reason people advocate for this is cause everyone involved is too imbecilic to consider that there might be other factors at work.

[benjipwns]

Just to be clear I think prisons should offer opportunities like this* and more for moral reasons, I just think this kind of cargo cult style reasoning is one of my least favorite "arguments" for policies. Like is often used for marriage, home ownership or degrees, that you just have to make there be more of them and the manna will fall on its own. It irritates, not to AWESOME-O and LeBron levels, quite a bit for some reason.

EDIT: *Maybe not exactly like this because of the incentive structure , but the general idea.

[Oblivion]

As the Toledo Blade reports, Joe the Plumber — a.k.a. Samuel Wurzelbacher — says he was required to join the United Auto Workers, now that he works for a union shop, and claims he’s been called a “Tea Bagger” by at least one pro-union co-worker. “I’m a Republican who was cast into the limelight for having the temerity to confront Barack Obama on the question of redistributing wealth,” Joe says. “But I’m a working man, and I’m working.”

http://www.balloon-juice.com/2014/02/18/joe-the-former-but-not-actually-plumber-update/

But really, how the fuck do you go from tea bagging superstar to union thug in such a short time? The guy was basically deified for his courageous stance as as non-rich guy defending the rich. You would think the wingnutosphere would have kept this douche employed for life.

[Mandark]

benji:  Well, good luck selling prison rehab programs based on empathy for convicts as fellow human beings!