US Politics Thread |OT| THE DARKEST TIMELINE

[tiesto]

As Bernie Sanders Makes History, Jews Wonder What It Means

But is it good for the Jews?

Didn't know he was Polish, that's pretty cool.

[Human Snorenado]

You'd think Hillary would realize by now that email isn't her strong suit

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/hillary-clinton/12150600/ImNotKiddingMaddi-trends-after-Hillary-Clinton-sends-email-asking-for-a-dollar-after-New-Hampshire-vote.html

[Madrun Badrun]

https://twitter.com/hannahmalcrckrs/status/697250799689203712/photo/1

[Brehvolution]

I'd like to find more info on this:
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/shamkhani-republican-prisonor-swap

"In the course of the talks for exchanging prisoners, the Republican rivals of the current US administration who claim to be humanitarians and advocates of human rights sent a message telling us not to release these people [American prisoners] and continue this process [of talks] until the eve of US presidential elections,” Shamkhani said, according to Tasnim.

"We acted upon our independent resolve and moved the process forward,” Shamkhani said.

The prisoner swap Shamkhani referred to included Washington Post journalist Jason Rezaian and three other U.S. citizens imprisoned in Iran, who were freed in exchange for the release of seven Iranians.

The swap was negotiated alongside the White House's nuclear deal with Iran, and the prisoners were released just before the economic sanctions on Iran were set to lift as part of the nuclear deal.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=213_1455213646

[benjipwns]

https://twitter.com/HillaryClinton/status/697852256557928448

[HyperZoneWasAwesome]

I'd like to find more info on this:
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/shamkhani-republican-prisonor-swap

"In the course of the talks for exchanging prisoners, the Republican rivals of the current US administration who claim to be humanitarians and advocates of human rights sent a message telling us not to release these people [American prisoners] and continue this process [of talks] until the eve of US presidential elections,” Shamkhani said, according to Tasnim.

"We acted upon our independent resolve and moved the process forward,” Shamkhani said.

The prisoner swap Shamkhani referred to included Washington Post journalist Jason Rezaian and three other U.S. citizens imprisoned in Iran, who were freed in exchange for the release of seven Iranians.

The swap was negotiated alongside the White House's nuclear deal with Iran, and the prisoners were released just before the economic sanctions on Iran were set to lift as part of the nuclear deal.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=213_1455213646

can anybody explain to me how this isn't treason?

[Joe Molotov]

I'd like to find more info on this:
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/shamkhani-republican-prisonor-swap

"In the course of the talks for exchanging prisoners, the Republican rivals of the current US administration who claim to be humanitarians and advocates of human rights sent a message telling us not to release these people [American prisoners] and continue this process [of talks] until the eve of US presidential elections,” Shamkhani said, according to Tasnim.

"We acted upon our independent resolve and moved the process forward,” Shamkhani said.

The prisoner swap Shamkhani referred to included Washington Post journalist Jason Rezaian and three other U.S. citizens imprisoned in Iran, who were freed in exchange for the release of seven Iranians.

The swap was negotiated alongside the White House's nuclear deal with Iran, and the prisoners were released just before the economic sanctions on Iran were set to lift as part of the nuclear deal.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=213_1455213646

can anybody explain to me how this isn't treason?

Because Ronald Reagan.

[brawndolicious]

They've always said that if a Republican wins, the Iranian deal is kaput so there's no point negotiating with Obama/Kerry. Kind of makes it hard to trust them when they're constantly criticizing you and doing near-treason against their commander-in-chief.

If there's proof of this, that certainly can be used as ammo in the general election debates but I doubt there's going to be any gavel-banging.

[Human Snorenado]

C'MON BABY FEEL THE JEB!MENTUM

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/bush-vows-take-it-trump

[brawndolicious]

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/we-get-it-you-vape-duncan-hunter

smh

[Madrun Badrun]

that last one, o god ouch

[Madrun Badrun]

[Mods Help]

Even as a Bernie supporter I have to say Hilary's closing statement in tonight's debate was absolutely wonderful. Sanders you need to include everything in government distrust. This includes Flint. This includes HERO going to  a vote because the government of Texas didn't like an inclusive bill that OUR city passed. There's so much to include in government distrust and the people not being taken care. Hilary got that clarified in a much more powerful way.

[benjipwns]

http://nypost.com/2016/02/12/apparently-we-should-get-on-a-boat-on-leave-america-asap/

The message from Thursday night’s Democratic debate is that everybody in America should get on a leaky rowboat and find somewhere, anywhere, else in the world to live — because life in the United States is a nightmare from which millionaires and billionaires and the Koch brothers and the Republicans will not allow us to awake.

The two candidates for the Democratic nomination spent most of two hours arguing over who was the better diagnostician of the moral diseases, ideological calamities, spiritual infirmities, racial injustices and downright evils that are being visited upon the suffering 320 million who have found themselves through no fault of their own trapped between two oceans in a dystopian oligarchic hell they call America.

Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders were essentially auditioning last night for the role of Snake Plissken. Do you remember Snake Plissken? He was the eyepatch-wearing hero of “Escape from New York,” the 1981 science-fiction picture in which Manhattan has become a prison and Snake Plissken is the only guy who can find the way out.

Only the America from which they want to liberate us is Barack Obama’s America. Oh, they don’t say as much. Hillary blames the Koch brothers. Bernie blames millionaires and billionaires and the campaign finance system. They both blame the Republicans.

But let’s face it: It’s Obama’s world. They and we are all just living in it.

And what a world. “There is,” Sanders said, “massive despair all over this country.” Wages low. Millions in prison.

The highest rate of childhood poverty in the world. The old have inadequate health care, don’t have enough money for food, are chopping up their pills to make them last longer.

Hillary said immigrants are living in fear. There’s systemic racism. Police brutality.

And don’t forget the horrors of being white, with “an increase in alcoholism, addiction, earlier deaths. People with a high school education or less are not even living as long as their parents lived . . . Coal miners and their families who helped turn on the lights and power our factories for generations are now wondering, has our country forgotten us?”

She concluded the debate by saying Sanders’s focus on punishing Wall Street was limited.

That’s because “if we were to stop that tomorrow, we would still have the indifference, the negligence that we saw in Flint. We would still have racism holding people back. We would still have sexism preventing women from getting equal pay. We would still have LGBT people who get married on Saturday and get fired on Monday. And we would still have governors like Scott Walker and others trying to rip out the heart of the middle class by making it impossible to organize and stand up for better wages and working conditions.”

Every now and then, one or the other would grudgingly say America had “potential,” but only to point out that it was potential to which it was not living up. Sanders even went into a long peroration about how horrible it was Hillary once said something nice about Henry Kissinger, who is 92 years old and last served as a US government official 40 years ago.

I thought “The Walking Dead” was a frightening vision of America. That zombie show is a walk in the park compared to Thursday night’s debate.

In the 1980s, Democrats found themselves forced to battle the impression that they were anti-American. So desperate were they to dispel this idea that at their convention in 1984, Democrats waved a thousand flags and chanted “USA” and sang the national anthem until their voices went hoarse.

And that was after four years of a Republican president.

In 2016, after seven years of a Democratic presidency, look where they are now.

[benjipwns]

[Human Snorenado]

Yet that version of America is still better than what the Republicans say we have

[Mods Help]

That article is frustrating. Yes, Obama's president, but it's American society that lead to this. From voters, non-voters, to politicians. Me, you, everyone. It's American society to blame; not one man.

[Great Rumbler]

Obama only got two years in which he could pass legislation, and he passed some pretty good stuff during that period. The past 5 years, going on 6 years, have been nothing but Republicans slamming down roadblocks at every opportunity. So, let's not act like Obama got to shape the entire country to his vision, or that the previous efforts of Republican Presidents simply vanished when Obama was elected.

[Mods Help]

still the last great hope of Earth

AHAHAHAHAHAHA

just got to this part while eating breakfast

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[Human Snorenado]

Obama is a pretty good President, but turned out to be a shit politician. Young people and minorities kept staying home during midterms, and crazy old white people freaked out and turned out better, so the country is fucked for a while. Hurry up and die, shitty old white people!

[CatsCatsCats]

Unfotunately, there's still a surprising amount of shitty, young, white people.

[Brehvolution]

http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/local/2016/02/11/bush-criticizes-kaisch-over-medicaid-expansion.html

“I am for repealing Obama care,” Kasich said. “But expanding Medicaid at this point, bringing our dollars back is working. It’s saving money and it’s saving lives. And that’s what really matters at the end of the day.”

 

[Mods Help]

Let's not attribute weed legalization to Obama.

[octopushover]

[Mods Help]

Obama is a pretty good President, but turned out to be a shit politician. Young people and minorities kept staying home during midterms, and crazy old white people freaked out and turned out better, so the country is fucked for a while. Hurry up and die, shitty old white people!

I'm not sure you can honestly say Obama was a "pretty good" president unless your standards for a good president are astonishingly low or you're playing pure teams at that point. Which is understandable after Bush. He's average at best. Obama is actually a pretty good politician. His way with words and charisma are endemic to his signature touch that still manages to captivate. We'll probably never have a charismatic President as Obama for a long time. Continuously trying to cajole and appeal to people who who do not and will not allow themselves to accept your position, rather than appeal to your own base, does not a good president make.

[ToxicAdam]

There's a lot of facets to being the president. Diplomat, deal maker, public speaker, party leader, cabinet manager, etc. I think he had strengths and weaknesses in all of those things.

So, it's hard for me to agree in calling him a "bad politician" when he was one of the greatest campaigners of our lifetime. Which is probably the core part of being a politician, actually getting elected.

   

[Brehvolution]

Let's not attribute weed legalization to Obama.

Do you think Mcain or Romney would keep the feds at bay like Obama has?

[benjipwns]

But the Nevada Democrat also added – in comments that underscore how some members of the Democratic establishment feel about the Sanders campaign – that Sanders’ huge online fundraising operation will sustain him to go the distance.

“The bigger problem is that Bernie is sitting on too much money to force him to quit,” the Democrat said. “Nor will his staff advise him to drop out if he suffers a string of March losses. His campaign is run by narcissists who are infatuated with their perception of their own genius, and they've got enough cash to hang around for quite a while.”

[tiesto]

Obama is the first black president and Osama got murked, gay marriage was passed, affordable health care was passed and weed legalization process started while dumb people were trying to stop him at all fronts under his reign.

He'll be the subject of an award winning movie a few decades down the line.

I think history will end up being pretty kind to Obama. Guy was dealt some super shitty hands when he started, and a congress whose primary aim was to block everything he did... not to mention the growth in 'green' tech, gay rights, the fact that he actually managed to pull off Obamacare, a drop in unemployment and the economy slowly getting back on its feet. Shit is certainly better than when Bush was in office.

[Steve Contra]

Let's not attribute weed legalization to Obama.

Do you think Mcain or Romney would keep the feds at bay like Obama has?

Yep.  Weed legalization was only on the table because there has been a tacit agreement to not prosecute.

[benjipwns]

Somebody should have told DOJ.

On October 15, 2010, however, Attorney General Eric Holder announced that federal authorities would continue to prosecute individuals for marijuana possession, even in states that have legalized it. That "threw a wet blanket" on enrollment at Oaksterdam, Jones said.

Then, last June, the Justice Department went even further. Deputy Attorney General James Cole argued in a memo that "caregiver" protections applied only to "individuals providing care to individuals with cancer or other serious illnesses, not commercial operations cultivating, selling or distributing marijuana." That meant pot shops, even those operating legally under state law, were vulnerable again.

Since then, the administration has unleashed an interagency cannabis crackdown that goes beyond anything seen under the Bush administration, with more than 100 raids, primarily on California pot dispensaries, many of them operating in full compliance with state laws. Since October 2009, the Justice Department has conducted more than 170 aggressive SWAT-style raids in 9 medical marijuana states, resulting in at least 61 federal indictments, according to data compiled by Americans for Safe Access, an advocacy group. Federal authorities have also seized property from landlords who rent space to growers, threatening them with prosecution, and authorities have even considered taking action against newspapers selling ad space to dispensaries.

"There's no question that Obama is the worst president on medical marijuana," Rob Kampia, executive director of the Marijuana Policy Project, told Rolling Stone in February.

The IRS has joined in the attack, invoking an arcane tax code provision originally intended to stymie druglords. That law, known as IRS Code Section 280E, is an uncontroversial measure aimed at preventing criminals from deducting the costs of their illicit activities from their taxable income. But the IRS has interpreted it to apply to medical marijuana dispensaries in such a way that they can no longer deduct the cost of salaries, rent, inventory and other operating expenses. Few brick-and-mortar businesses are able to survive under those terms, as taxes end up being substantially larger than profits.

And that was in 2012.

I think history will end up being pretty kind

[Human Snorenado]

Obama is a pretty good President, but turned out to be a shit politician. Young people and minorities kept staying home during midterms, and crazy old white people freaked out and turned out better, so the country is fucked for a while. Hurry up and die, shitty old white people!

I'm not sure you can honestly say Obama was a "pretty good" president unless your standards for a good president are astonishingly low or you're playing pure teams at that point. Which is understandable after Bush. He's average at best. Obama is actually a pretty good politician. His way with words and charisma are endemic to his signature touch that still manages to captivate. We'll probably never have a charismatic President as Obama for a long time. Continuously trying to cajole and appeal to people who who do not and will not allow themselves to accept your position, rather than appeal to your own base, does not a good president make.

No. Obama is a pretty good President. All that "appeal to the base" shit like a public option, publicly murdering Wall Street execs (which as we all know I'm way in favor of), etc is all pie in the sky. Obama got as much shit done as he possibly could, and then some considering that for the first two years he had to appease stupid red/purple state dems in the Senate, and then from 2011 on has been saddled with the worst Congress in fucking history. Not seeing that means you're an idealist rather than a pragmatist.

There's a lot of facets to being the president. Diplomat, deal maker, public speaker, party leader, cabinet manager, etc. I think he had strengths and weaknesses in all of those things.

So, it's hard for me to agree in calling him a "bad politician" when he was one of the greatest campaigners of our lifetime. Which is probably the core part of being a politician, actually getting elected.

Shitty party builder? Field general? Listen, the fact remains that his electoral coalition didn't show up in 2010 and 2014, and that's the reason we have the shittiest, dumbest, most intractable Congress in all of history. These people are so dumb they don't know what the debt limit is. Letting them anywhere near the levers of power in this country is borderline criminal.

[Steve Contra]

That actually started because a bunch of dispensaries were operating as non-profits and actually profiting a lot.  So when it says "in full compliance of the law" it actually means "not in compliance at all"

[Human Snorenado]

If true: game on, bitches

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/polltracker/sanders-clinton-tied-nevada

[benjipwns]

Plus that whole distribution thing being against federal law.

[Steve Contra]

Nah, plenty of places that were actually operating above board didn't get touched.  The result of the raids was actually a huge plus for the medical industry because it flushed lots of people dragging it down out of the system.

[Joe Molotov]

Unfotunately, there's still a surprising amount of shitty people.

[Human Snorenado]

Unfotunately, there's still a surprising amount of shitty people.

"surprising"

[benjipwns]

Donald J. Trump ‏@realDonaldTrump  6m6 minutes ago
If @TedCruz doesn’t clean up his act, stop cheating, & doing negative ads, I have standing to sue him for not being a natural born citizen.

[Joe Molotov]

I guess we know one immigrant that's not getting let back in through the yoooge, classy door in the wall.

[Human Snorenado]

The dream is over

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/jim-gilmore-dropping-2016-campaign

[Mandark]

I'm not sure you can honestly say Obama was a "pretty good" president unless your standards for a good president are astonishingly low or you're playing pure teams at that point. Which is understandable after Bush. He's average at best. Obama is actually a pretty good politician. His way with words and charisma are endemic to his signature touch that still manages to captivate. We'll probably never have a charismatic President as Obama for a long time. Continuously trying to cajole and appeal to people who who do not and will not allow themselves to accept your position, rather than appeal to your own base, does not a good president make.

If he's not "pretty good" who is?

[I'm a Puppy!]

Obama's the best republican president we've had in a while.

[Atramental]

And Hillary will be an excellent republican president as well. 

spoiler (click to show/hide)

totally joking. please don't eviserate me. 

[close]

[Phoenix Dark]

I'm not sure you can honestly say Obama was a "pretty good" president unless your standards for a good president are astonishingly low or you're playing pure teams at that point. Which is understandable after Bush. He's average at best. Obama is actually a pretty good politician. His way with words and charisma are endemic to his signature touch that still manages to captivate. We'll probably never have a charismatic President as Obama for a long time. Continuously trying to cajole and appeal to people who who do not and will not allow themselves to accept your position, rather than appeal to your own base, does not a good president make.

If he's not "pretty good" who is?

*awaits Mods naming a problematic president so I can get my troll on*

[Joe Molotov]

I'm not sure you can honestly say Obama was a "pretty good" president unless your standards for a good president are astonishingly low or you're playing pure teams at that point. Which is understandable after Bush. He's average at best. Obama is actually a pretty good politician. His way with words and charisma are endemic to his signature touch that still manages to captivate. We'll probably never have a charismatic President as Obama for a long time. Continuously trying to cajole and appeal to people who who do not and will not allow themselves to accept your position, rather than appeal to your own base, does not a good president make.

If he's not "pretty good" who is?

*awaits Mods naming a problematic president so I can get my troll on*

GWB kept us safe.

[Mupepe]

GWB really tired the country together. Did he not?

[Dickie Dee]

Whoever's still around here in a few years, it'll be pretty funny looking back at the Obama post-mortem going on now after he's been bookended by GWB and Trump and/or Cruz

[Mandark]

20-30 years from now, whenever the next Democratic president has Congressional majorities and a shot to get stuff passed, liberals are all going to wring their hands over the compromises being made and say "Roosevelt, Johnson, and Obama wouldn't have settled for this!  Those guys got stuff done!"

I will be the most insufferable old man when that happens.

[Phoenix Dark]

In like 30 years when the ACA includes Medicare for all and people give Obama the credit just like FDR gets credit for non-widows having Social Security now
  @ Sanders stans forgotten by history

[Atramental]

 

[Mods Help]

http://usuncut.com/news/the-dnc-opens-the-gates-to-unlimited-wall-street-funding/



Bring it.

[Mods Help]

Let's not attribute weed legalization to Obama.

Do you think Mcain or Romney would keep the feds at bay like Obama has?

it's a maybe. but let's not act like weed legalization as it is, had anything to do with obama. it became a thing because people were sick of it. It was a long time coming. put weed legalization at the feet of obama is also hilarity given he shut down far more medical marijuana places than bush. But democrats gonna democrat, i guess. romney or mccain keeping feds at bay is entirely dependent on whether or not they like the smell of the money coming from Colorado. make no mistake, I'm pretty sure Obama administration like the same aspect of weed legalization, since it also helps boost his "job creation" talking point. Never mind the $$$.

[Mandark]

Can we please, please, please not pretend to believe counterfactual scenarios where a Republican administration does nice things for no reason?

I know you're loathe to give any credit for anything to establishment Dems, but c'mon now.

[Mods Help]

In like 30 years when the ACA includes Medicare for all and people give Obama the credit just like FDR gets credit for non-widows having Social Security now
  @ Sanders stans forgotten by history

Pretty funny but no cigar. Not sure "Sanders stans" are going to be forgotten in history.

If bernie loses, wins. it's still win-win, either way. on one hand, if bernie wins, we win. If he loses, we still win because there's an unprecedented interest - in decades - in socialism. If he loses, and we organize, expect many of those people to join up. we're organizing right now. Kshama Sawant ran in seattle last election and won. This is her second time winning. Kshama is the socialist figure head in charge of the 15 dollar wage campaign passed in Seattle. Due to Bernie, that ideology is spreading. More and more people are aware of and not afraid of socialism thanks to one man. even if bernie loses, we will still be far more ahead, as a political movement, than 4 years ago. if you think peoples criticism of capitalism and inequality will disappear if bernie loses then i don't know what to say.

this is just the start, and this issue will only get worse.

comparing obama to fdr though, that's the best part tbh, and shows just how insane and delusional the modern democratic party and their supporters are.

i read someone earlier today asking whether or not obama is the democratic party's reagan given clinton not getting off his dick last night. then someone else said obama stopped a second depression (). much like the republican party's reagan idolatry, i wouldn't necessarily label obama's legacy and democrat worship as necessarily a good thing.

[Mandark]

comparing obama to fdr though, that's the best part tbh, and shows just how insane and delusional the modern democratic party and their supporters are.

do educate us

[Mods Help]

Obama's legacy could go in many ways.

On one hand, he did propose and create ACA. I credit him that. It's the reason I have and many in my family have healthcare. I love ACA for what it is, though it could be better. I bought medicine the other day. Oh wait, I didn't. I got it for free. I nearly cried in happiness. Thanks Obama.

On the other hand, the man won the Nobel Peace Prize, but still waged terrorist hunts in foreign nations killing innocents. Black sites on American land increased under Obama's presidency. Never mind his influence and future signing of TPP.

That's what I mean by delusional. And that's just on one topic. You think it's guaranteed because of pedantic tribalism despite Obama's extremely mixed record. You have no idea what the politics and issues of tomorrow may be, and you purposely don't consider the missteps that Obama did just as much as his positives. I wouldn't be nearly so :troll if so many people - often Democrats because it comes with the territory - would at least have the self respect to admit that Obama's legacy is mixed. It wasn't a good presidency. It was mired with setbacks and pitfalls even without mentioning congress. I would respect many of you more on this issue if you admitted there are consequences with his presidency that may be long lasting and entirely negative. TPP is one of them. Drones is another.

As for your earlier question, on a pretty good president? I have no idea what a pretty good president even is. I'm out for presidents who represent me, so my view of a pretty good president is going to be really different than others'. I guess the closest I can say is Lincoln and FDR. FDR for his Second Bill of Rights especially. Shame that never came to fruition.

I also find it curious that the same group of people lamenting old white people are perfectly fine with giving the president that has had the wealth of minorities plummet as low as it is now as under Obama the co-sign. Maybe it's because idealistic, but I respect Iceland for putting bankers who caused the economic collapse of 2008 in jail. I don't really see being pro-establishment and throwing your own people under the bus exactly the qualities of a good president. No, I don't. You can laugh and make jokes about that, but nothing will sway me. If deferring to money and power stands as "pretty good" that merely exemplifies our already low standards as it is.

The crux of the matter is that during a time when American people needed someone to fight for them the most, Obama never stepped up. You can argue for ACA, but else can you say? Anything?

[Mandark]

I don't really see being pro-establishment and throwing your people under the bus exactly the qualities of a good president. No, I don't.

How familiar are you with FDR's record?

[benjipwns]

GWB really tired the country together. Did he not?

A uniter, not a divider.

[Phoenix Dark]